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| Super Episode 50 (3 July 2016) | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Jul 3 2016, 12:29 AM (15,728 Views) | |
| + ThePrinceOfSaiyans | Jul 3 2016, 12:29 AM Post #1 |
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魔王子
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And we learned nothing! Well, aside from the fact that Mai is alive. Black does destroy Trunks's time machine tho, but Bulma remembers the one that Cell came back in time in, so they still have one in reserve! Also, we have a new ending song. It's garbage, but the ending sequence is cool tho. EDIT: Summary
Edited by ThePrinceOfSaiyans, Jul 3 2016, 02:25 AM.
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| + Clearin | Jul 3 2016, 12:31 AM Post #2 |
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The second Trunks time machine was destroyed I wondered if they were gonna remember the one Cell came in. I'm actually quite surprised they even remembered that. |
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| + ThePrinceOfSaiyans | Jul 3 2016, 12:33 AM Post #3 |
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Man, if the 2-base theory is legit, Goku-Black is a b***. Super Saiyan 2 Goku stalemated him. EDIT: Oh, very interesting tidbit here:
Edited by ThePrinceOfSaiyans, Jul 3 2016, 01:06 AM.
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| + ThePrinceOfSaiyans | Jul 3 2016, 01:15 AM Post #4 |
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Sorry for the double post, but I think we have ourselves another plot hole. The time machine Bulma found should be connected to the timeline Cell came from. How the Hell is Trunks going to use it to go back to his timeline? Also, didn't Trunks put Cell's time machine in his own capsule case? If so, that's two plot holes. |
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| + Clearin | Jul 3 2016, 02:39 AM Post #5 |
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Well they can be easily explained. There can just be some kind of control in the time machine that let's you jump between timelines, and Trunks could have given Bulma Cell's time machine at some point. |
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| + ThePrinceOfSaiyans | Jul 3 2016, 02:46 AM Post #6 |
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I'm pretty sure the time machines are linked to their specific timelines. |
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| + Clearin | Jul 3 2016, 02:59 AM Post #7 |
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They don't have to be. If you wanna stop this being a plot hole you can just with that simple explanation. Edit: In fact, I'm pretty sure Trunks have gone back to two different futures. One where Cell kills him, and one where he kills Cell. Edited by Clearin, Jul 3 2016, 03:06 AM.
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| + ThePrinceOfSaiyans | Jul 3 2016, 03:09 AM Post #8 |
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But that's a rather contrived rationalization that honestly just creates more questions. Why would Bulma design the time machine with the capability to travel to multiple timelines? Furthermore, why would Trunks be taken back by the fact that the time machine operates under multiverse theory if the time machine had the capability to travel to multiple timelines.
What? Edited by ThePrinceOfSaiyans, Jul 3 2016, 03:14 AM.
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| + Clearin | Jul 3 2016, 03:15 AM Post #9 |
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Bulma would design the time machine to do that because she knew that travelling back in time would create new timelines. Trunks knew the time machine operated under multiverse theory. It is true that in a certain moment he did forget about this fact. Trunks suggests going back in time (when he was already in the past) to destroy the androids before they're activated. Gohan questions if that would destroy the present time androids but then Trunks remembers that this whole thing runs on a multiverse theory. We know that he already knew this because Yamcha asked why Trunks came back to the past if it wouldn't change his future, and Trunks responded with: A) Bulma said there deserves to be at least one peaceful future B) They could find a weakness of the androids by watching Goku fight them (so Goku beating them in the present wouldn't destroy them in the future) C) Maybe they could bring Goku to "our" future to defeat the androids. Note that he specifically says "our" future, not just "the" future. Trunks already had justifications for going into the past knowing full well that it wouldn't change his future, and we also know Bulma knew this too because many of those reasons were given to him by Bulma.
Future Trunks goes to one future where he is killed by Cell (this is the Cell that takes his time machine and becomes the Cell we know) and one future where he kills Cell, which is the one we see in the manga. Edited by Clearin, Jul 3 2016, 03:17 AM.
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| + ThePrinceOfSaiyans | Jul 3 2016, 03:20 AM Post #10 |
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I'm pretty sure Trunks wasn't aware of multiverse theory until Gohan put forth the idea when they were transporting Goku to Kame House.
That seems like a plot hole on the manga's part, as the Trunks in Cell's timeline had already gone back in time to find a way to deactivate the Artificial Humans. The coordinates were already set on that time machine, so that time machine should have gone to the timeline that Trunks had already visited. Edited by ThePrinceOfSaiyans, Jul 3 2016, 03:24 AM.
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| + Clearin | Jul 3 2016, 03:27 AM Post #11 |
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Gohan didn't put forth the idea. He merely questioned what would happen if Trunks went back in time to destroy the androids, and whether it would destroy the androids in the current time too. It's then Trunks who remembers that it works on multiverse theory and explains it all to everyone. Trunks would have to be incredibly stupid to not realise the multiverse theory when all of Bulma's reasoning for going back in time works on the fact it wouldn't save his own timeline. The only line that hints of Trunks not knowing this is when he first goes back to the past and says Vegeta and Bulma not doing their thing might "cause him to not be born". But every other line from that period indicates he knows full well he's not going to change his future - he tells Goku that he can "go home and reassure his mother", something that would be pointless if his future was going to be changed by the time he had got back there. And he tells Goku that in 3 years if he's still alive he'll come back to help fight, but in his mind the futures fate would have been decided before he'd even gotten back home. The line about him not being born could by that point easily just be explained by the fact he meant present timeline Trunks not being born, not him specifically. In any case, I think that the fact all of Trunks' reasoning for returning to the past involves multiverse theory explanations, that it's proof enough Trunks knew about it.
Cell went back 1 year before Trunks first arrived, creating a new timeline. Basically the 4 timelines go like this: Timeline A: Goku kills Freeza. Androids kill everyone, Trunks goes back in time to timeline B. Trunks arrives back. Trunks goes back to B again. Trunks comes back once more. Trunks beats future androids (not stated how) and gets killed by future Cell. Cell goes back in time to timeline C Timeline B: Trunks kills Freeza. Trunks warns everyone. Trunks goes back to timeline A. Trunks comes back 3 years later. They beat the androids. Trunks goes back to timeline A. Timeline C: Main timeline. Trunks kills Freeza. Warns everyone. Goes back to A. Comes back 3 years later. Everything up to the end of the Cell Games happens. Trunks goes back to a NEW timeline now - Timeline D Timeline D: Everything is the same as timeline A up until "Trunsk comes back once more". Trunks comes back, kills the androids then kills Cell. The Trunks in timeline D and timeline A are completely different. The Trunks that returns in timeline D is much stronger and two years older. Since Timeline A can only possibly have one of these Trunks be the one who returns to it, a new timeline is created by this stronger, older Trunks going back. And as a result of a stronger Trunks returning, timeline D differs from timeline A by allowing Trunks to beat Cell. He also presumably kills the androids in a different way (thought to be the remote in timeline A). Edited by Clearin, Jul 3 2016, 03:37 AM.
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| + ThePrinceOfSaiyans | Jul 3 2016, 03:43 AM Post #12 |
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Why would setting the time machine back a year force the time machine into a different timeline? |
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| + Clearin | Jul 3 2016, 03:46 AM Post #13 |
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Every change to the past creates a new timeline, and someone travelling back in time is a change to the past. And logically it'd be impossible for it not to. There has to have been a timeline where Cell wasn't in the past because for Cell to have time travelled, history needed to have already happened once without Cell time travelling. We know that Cell comes from a timeline where his Trunks had already travelled to the past. So that Trunks must have travelled to a past where Cell didn't exist - because his Cell hadn't travelled back in time before his Trunks did. Edited by Clearin, Jul 3 2016, 03:47 AM.
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| + Pyrus | Jul 3 2016, 05:25 AM Post #14 |
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You guys are getting me all f***ed up with this time travel hubbaloo. So Black isn't in his true body? Not another Ginyu reveal! Black is definitely not just an evil Goku...damn. Edited by Pyrus, Jul 3 2016, 05:29 AM.
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| Zoom | Jul 3 2016, 05:51 AM Post #15 |
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"Oh Bebi" |
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